Saturday, June 6, 2009

Special Edition: SCSA

Welcome to a Special Edition of Conceive This! As we have all learned, our doctors all have an opinion. Didn't you ever wonder how my doctor's opinion completely contradicts your doctor's opinion? Do you wonder how they actually reach their conclusions about things? Maybe you did wonder, or maybe you could care less. I always wonder.

For every test, for every medication, for every diagnosis, I didn't just want to hear, "You must do X, Y, Z." I wanted to know what X, Y, and Z were. I wanted to know what research had been done on X, Y, and Z. I wanted to know what the textbooks said about X, Y, and Z. I wanted to know how X, Y, and Z impacted the reproductive system, the circulatory system, the 'you-so-crazy' system.

In this special edition, we will take some time to educate ourselves about the SCSA test, evaluate the evidence surrounding it, and make comparisons regarding just how shitty our comparative semen specimens really are. This special edition is not meant to influence your decision to have an SCSA, to give an opinion about your choice of having done an SCSA, or to cause you to scream at your doctor for have/not having made this test available to you. As with most things in life, you can do whatever the hell you want...you just better know what the hell you're doing.

If you have male-factor infertility, or even if you have had recurrent pregnancy loss or implantation failure, your doctor may suggest performing an SCSA test. The SCSA is a test that examines the DNA within the sperm for fragmentation. Fragment-who-tion? This test checks the DNA within the sperm for damage, breakage, and general nastiness. Why do we care about DNA nastiness? Well, as many of you know, those perfect little babies we desire are made up of 46 chromosomes. 23 of those chromosomes come from the egg, and 23 come from the sperm. When those 23 chromosomes combine, an embryo is formed, well, technically a zygote is formed, but whatever.

If fertilization occurs, the egg will chug along on it's own devices for about 3 days or so. Why? Sperm DNA damage does not appear to affect fertilization or the 2nd or 3rd cell division. On the 3rd day of division, when the embryo is around 4-8 cells, the 46 chromosomes activate.

Ding! The lights of potential life turn on, and the embryo's own DNA will control cell division and differentiation from 8 cells to two-thousand-hundred-gazillion-trillion cells. However, if the DNA from either the egg or the sperm is damaged, things won't proceed up to twothousandgazilliontrillion cells. Instead, things may proceed up to 12 cells, or 100 cells, or 259 cells...and then self-destruct in a process called apoptosis. Bam!.......the process goes haywire, the instructions are lost, and the embryo 'arrests'...which is a friendly way of saying 'stops dividing and disintegrates.'

This may happen once. This may happen twice. This may happen over and over and over until you run out of money or choose to move on. Is there a way to know if this may happen to you over and over and over again? The simple answer is no, however scientists, embryologists, and reproductive embryologists would love to be able to predict the future in this sense.....so invention happened.

You may think that the acronym 'SCSA' stands for 'Super Crappy Sperm Analysis', and in all reality, that is exactly what it is. SCSA actually stands for 'sperm chromatin structure assay.' What does that mean? The SCSA is a test that is able to measure the approximate percentage of sperm cells containing damaged DNA. Knowledge regarding the percentage of DNA fragmentation provides knowledge and information, but can it help guide treatment?

How does this test work? Easy. You send about 0.5mL of frozen sperm to a lab along with a few hundred dollars, and you wait a few weeks. When your sperm arrive at the lab, they will be defrosted and given a color job. They are treated with a special orange dye that attaches to broken DNA...so the damaged sperm will light up like a game hunter in a protective 'don't shoot me' jacket. After the touch-up, ten-thousand sperm will be analyzed by a machine called a flow cytometer, where they are lined up single file and passed under a beam of light that detects the orange dye. So, the super-crappy sperm are orange, and the normal sperm look green (because that grass is always greener). Your results are sent to you as a DNA Fragmentation Index, or DFI, which is the percentage of crappy sperm within the sample.

Why might this be important? The DFI has been associated with fertility potential as per the following:

Less than 15% DFI: Excellent potential
15%-30% DFI: Fair to Good potential
More than 30% DFI: Buh-bye. Poor potential.

So? And? What does this mean? Well, like all good opinions, it depends on who you ask. After reviewing a multitude of studies, there are some common themes that emerge...and some common controversies.

Number one common theme: If your DFI is >30%, shell out some cash and pay for IVF/ICSI. Most studies indicate very poor fertility potential if the percentage of damaged sperm is in the poor category, hence the name 'poor', as in, 'if you are in this category you will be poor by the time you get pregnant because you will have spent all your money on fertility treatments'. Fear not, because there are reported healthy pregnancies in patients with a DFI >60%....though I only found reports of this after IVF/ICSI.

Number two common theme: High DNA fragmentation is without a doubt correlated to severe male factor infertility. The crappier the sperm, the higher the liklihood that the DNA is damaged. However, high levels of DNA fragmentation have been found in sperm that a conventional semen analysis would not have tagged as severely abnormal. Signs that the DNA integrity may be compromised? Unexplained infertility, arrested embryo development, poor blastocyst development, multiple failed IVF/ICSI treatment, recurrent miscarriage in partner. Of course, remember. These same signs exist when egg quality is an issue...because even if it's the egg it is always a question of the DNA.

Do I need this test? The SCSA, like many diagnostic tests, provides information. It may or may not help you to make a decision. When the SCSA was first introduced, many studies were done. The initial studies pretty much said everyone should have an SCSA because it was impossible to get pregnant if your DFI was >30%. Indeed, it is more difficult, but after the initial flood of studies reporting the necessity of this test, several others came out that contradicted the first. These studies cited pregnancies even with elevated DFI in patients who utilized IVF/ICSI. Information may be a good thing. It may help you choose between an IUI and IVF. It may help you with nothing. It may provide you with relief, it may also provide you with anxiety. Do you need the test? It's up to you and your doctor.

What does the American Society of Reproductive Medicine say?
The guidelines set forth by the ASRM are what reproductive endocrinologists abide by...generally speaking. You can read what the ASRM has to say about the utility of sperm DNA testing here.

The summary is this:
  • "Existing data on the relationship between abnormal DNA integrity and reproductive outcomes is limited.
  • Sperm DNA damage is more common in infertile men and may affect reproductive outcomes in selected couples, including those with spontaneous miscarriage or idiopathic infertility.
  • At present, the results of sperm DNA integrity testing alone do not predict pregnancy rates achieved with intercourse, IUI, IVF and ICSI.
  • Currently, there is no proven role for routine DNA integrity testing in the evaluation of infertility.
  • Treatments for abnormal DNA integrity have not been shown to have clinical value"

(The Practice Committee of the American Society of Reproductive Medicine, 2008).

That being said, the multitude of studies may speak for themselves. Every physician will have an opinion. Information is not necessarily a bad thing. However, if that information will not change your ultimate treatment goals, well, do you really care to know? Some do. Some don't.

What did I do? I read all about the SCSA and went to our initial consultation all but demanding it. My physician explained to me that he does utilize the SCSA in cases where couples want to try using timed intercourse or IUI, he does not recommend the test in cases where IVF/ICSI will be utilized. Why? It is simply not needed. Even if the sperm DNA were severely fragmented, the recommendation would be to attempt A.R.T. with IVF/ICSI, since the research has shown it is possible (though less likely) to achieve that fabled state of pregnancy even with a high level of sperm DNA fragmentation.

Given our embryo progression with our first IVF, the assumption can be made that my husband does have a high percentage of DNA fragmentation. The signs? Excellent fertilization and embryo development up to day three...followed by slowed development and embryo arrest after day 3. Although it is encouraging that four blastocysts were attained, we had implantation failure on our first attempt with two very good looking embryos. Classic.

Does that mean it can't happen? Does that mean it won't happen? No. I could get pregnant on the next round. Who knows. I do know that an SCSA won't tell me if my FET will work. It won't tell me my next fresh cycle won't work. It may provide me with relief if it came back at an 'acceptable' percentage...or it may cause me undue anxiety if it came back at 55%.

My paranoid opinion: Although there are cases where pregnancy was achieved in cases where DNA fragmentation was high...there seems to be more evidence that, even with ICSI, it is far less likely to conceive when there are high levels of sperm damage. Suspicious Murgdan says, "ASRM won't advocate for using DFI as a predictive value, because they would then have to stop recommending repeated expensive IVF/ICSI attempts in cases where pregnancy was unlikely due to severe MFI. REs want to make money. They don't make money by proving IVF won't work for you before you've even tried it."

The coolest thing I learned while researching this? The oocyte can repair DNA Fragmentation. Check it out.

"Metaphase II oocytes can repair, to some extent, DNA damage in sperm after fertilization by pre- and post-replication repair mechanisms. This will depend mainly on the extent of sperm DNA fragmentation and the cytoplasmic and genomic quality of the oocyte. The latter would be expected to be higher in oocytes from younger women. Therefore, the efficiency of the oocyte to repair DNA damage in the spermatozoon would be expected to decrease with female age."(Alvarez, J. G. (2005) The predictive value of SCSA. Human Reproduction)

"Protection against high DNA fragmentation may be afforded by younger oocytes which are much more efficient at DNA repair of defective sperm than older oocytes, so a couple coming for assisted conception treatment where the sperm DNA fragmentation level is high has a better prognosis if his partner is young." (The Doctor's Laboratory).

I think my thirty-something oocytes have a lot of work to do....




If you want more information about the SCSA or DNA fragmentation, you could read here, here, and here. So? Did you do the SCSA? If so, what were your results?

If you've read this far, you know one thing for certain...I'm a nerd. Also, maybe you learned something. Maybe you learned nothing and already knew all of that, but at least I learned something, notably that I'm buying my eggs a gift certificate to Home Depot. The next Special Edition will discuss Hyaluronic Acid Binding and the PICSI study. Aren't you on the edge of your seat?

40 conceptions:

sprogblogger said...

I totally learned something! Thanks, Murgdan!

sprogblogger said...

I totally learned something! Thanks, Murgdan!

ToddV said...

THANKS! I tried consulting with Dr. Google yesterday about the sperm DNA fragmentation test, but didn't get all this much info so readily.

Our RE did not recommend SCSA until now - he explained a lot of clinics recommend it early but he feels it's not necessary unless certain negative outcomes are attained. Which is where we are now, on the precipice of choosing donor eggs - and prior to moving to that step, he wants this test done to rule out any sperm DNA fragmentation issues that might be underlying our issues.

In our 2nd cycle, we got to Day 5 with 10 blasts, but the abnormal chromosomal results from PGD testing canceled our txfr. So, some of the 'classic' symptoms, indeed.

Thanks, again. Your posting was much easier to read and understand than some of the stuff I found online. And I'll check out the links you posted as well.

Hillary said...

That was VERY helpful -- thank you!! From another MFI girl...

makingmemom.blogspot.com

JamieD said...

Conceive This! - Funny AND educational.

Thanks!

For the record, I also think it is all a scam so the docs can make more money. I mean, we ~all~ know that one Mercedes in the driveway isn't enough.

'Murgdan' said...

Yeah, but I think the doctors must be torn. On one hand, they want to make money...on the other hand, they want good statistics. $12,000 failures are still failures.

bendingbackwards said...

I learned something today! Thanks!

I have always wanted to ask a doctor, "Where did you go to school?" Sometimes I am convinced they went to Google University.

Phoebe said...

Very informative and educational! My problem is the opposite of yours. Even though my DH's sperm have been frozen for 15 years, they are completely fine. I think his sperm quality repairs my egg quality, in an opposite way you described with oocytes repairing sperm damage. I'm a total nerd too! You've got to do your own research and be your own advocate because the docs just do not have the time to spend with you as you need. What about the research on improving sperm quality? I've read that Chinese medicine/acupuncture can help with this, but have no personal experience with it.

Bella said...

Very interesting! And you're still young, so I think your eggs are up for the task! :)

Kate said...

Great post! We got a 27.4% on our SCSI, and the report said fair fertility potential. The urologist said that they've seen men with much worse numbers get pregnant before.
I guess we'll find out soon if this IVF attempt gets to retrieval.

Cassandra said...

Since we don't have a male factor diagnosis, I hadn't heard of this test. As an infertile nerd, I am glad to learn about something new -- thanks!

Another Julia said...

Anybody who can work the word "apoptosis" into a blog post is my hero! You are most definitely a science nerd, which is never a bad thing. :)

We didn't do the SCSA (or the zona-free hamster egg penetration assay--ever hear of that weird one? I always envisioned half-human, half-hamster babies running around our house. Forget the crib, we need a Habitrail!).
Our RE didn't think testing was needed because we were destined for IVF/ICSI, and also because it wasn't commonly done in 2002 (when we did our first cycle). After our son was born it became kind of moot. I am sure that I would have been horrified at the results--my husband's swimmers are like a microscopic freak show.

Very informative post...and yes, I definitely am looking forward to the PICSI entry. Had to google that when you mentioned it before...what a neat technology. Anything that gives ART a better chance of working is pretty much the holy grail as far as I'm concerned. Anyone who visits the IF seventh circle of hell deserves all of the technological help they can get!

one-hit_wonder said...

Thanks for writing this up - I'm going to link to this post. My guy had the SCSA done, and it was a relief to us to learn the results. If the results had been lousy, we would have ended the ART treatments, so we personally found the test valuable, though I understand why others would have different perspectives.

Meg. said...

Murgden, you're great. =)

Very informative class. As a fellow information junkie (and scientist IRL), I can't get enough of this stuff.

Definitely looking forward to your next installment, and hoping it means good news for Mr. and Mrs. Murgden.

areyoukiddingme said...

No MFI, here, but I read the whole thing anyway. Guess who else is a nerd? Anyway, my compliments - you make a very complex issue very readable and understandable.

Blossom and Her Fruit said...

Wow. This post totally started a yucky convo between me and my hubby. I am trying to figure out if I should use my shitty eggs for another cycle or go to donor. I read this and remember that DH has 35% fragmentation on his test. So if your research is right, we are screwed. DH says he doesn't believe it. My eggs just started crying, I think they need swaddling...

Just Another Infertile said...

I have what may be a stupid question, but you are here to educate me if it is. If they can tell damaged DNA sperm from "normal" DNA sperm, why can't they use this technology to find only the normal sperm to use for ICSI?

Andrea said...

Thanks for posting this, and I did indeed learn something. This is not actually a test I have heard of, strangely, since we pretty much have the same diagnosis of you and, like you, had great looking embryos that ended in a failed IVF. Perhaps my degree in Dr. Google is not as good as your actual medical focused degree:)

Another Dreamer said...

Wow. That "coolest thing" you learned? That is so freaking interesting!

The test is very fascinating too.

Thanks for the super informative post!

Courtney said...

I learned something from your wealth of science knowledge!

I SO wish I could snap my fingers and make you pregnant- I really do!

Melissa G said...

Absolutely fantastic post. Thank you for sharing all of your research, and putting into english for the rest of us non-scientific-nerds.

For me, this post reconfirms our decision to go donor. Our RE mentioned that my husband's SA results were indicative of a chromosomal error. So he was tested for Y Chromosome Microdeletion, but the results came back negative and we decided not to pursue any further testing. My husband and I were uneasy with what his concerns implicated. We sort of looked at his test results as Natural Selection... (Although we still considered IVF w/ICSI, and if money weren't such a huge factor, we may have still gone through with it)

Sorry for rambling. Seriously though, this is an amazing post. Thank you so much.

sharonvw said...

Its ok to be a little sad, its not about jealousy or envy, but more about longing.
I too know how this feels for you & I also looked at the photo with a sense of longing and wondering.
(((hugs)))

sarah said...

You = Book Deal.

Seriously.

That bit about oocytes is amazing. I love it when you break it down!

Michelle said...

Thanks I learned something today. I never knew about this.

Kristin said...

Absolutely fascinating! Thanks for the education.

Shinejil said...

This was great, Murgdan! I really enjoy learning about this stuff, and your humor and grasp of the subject made it easy to do so. It just makes me heart you more--from one nerd to another!

I'll be looking forward to the next Special Edition.

geeksinrome said...

you should totally open up your own fertility clinic!! incredibly interesting

and i love how even in egg form, women are still fixing other people's mistakes....

Pie said...

Long time lurker, but I had to comment, because that was soooooo helpful. I am an info junkie too, with a science background, and I often feel like doctors won't talk to me like I have a brain. Please do more posts like that, you truly have a gift for summarizing complex data in a readable format. Thanks again!

Fran said...

Great info! thanks a lot, I'm just about to get my DH tested for this and it's so comforting to know that the eggcan do a repair job!

Chelle said...

Both educational AND funny!!!

I give you kudos on all your research!

Infertility is Hard said...

You are an AMAZING wealth of information. :-D Thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge. I know I learned something, and will definitely be bringing this up at my WTF appointment this week! :-D

Bubba said...

Hey, thanks for commenting on my blog....your right, people are stupid. And the picture of the drink you liked is totally yours, right after you give birth to a precious little bundle ;).
Thanks for the info - we are MFI, its a scary business !
xx xx xx

A Few Good Sperm said...

Great post--I wish our urologist explained things this way!

R.J. said...

We did the SCSA test and it was not so helpful. Our old RE recommended the test. It came back bad - 42% prewash and 56% post-wash (or so). Our new RE and urologist said that sperm DNA fragmentation with severe male factor is basically a "duh". The worse the sperm, the higher the fragmentation. They also said that there are studies showing that those with high fragmentation can get pregnant. It just may take longer. So if you are doing IVF/ICSI, a diagnosis of sperm dna fragmentation doesn't change the protocol since unfortunately, the test for fragmentation "ruins" the sperm. More proof that science not quite as advanced as it should be with male factor.

That being said, we are trying 3 mos. of Proxeed Plus based on some studies showing it has helped fragmentation levels (as well as basic sperm parameters) before our next cycle. Mostly because I feel we need to change things up to obtain a different result.

Hope in Virginia said...

Hi!!! I just discovered your blog and really love it. So many of the emotions you describe, I've felt as well. We start our first IVF cycle this month...and I just started my own blog because I want the same kind of community you seem to have as you go through this difficult process. Hope you'll check out my blog - http://hopeinvirginia.blogspot.com/ - and I will keep checking back for updates on your journey.

PJ said...

I have never heard of that test, but I agree with your suspicions. We have that low morphology issue, so they went right to IVF/ICSI. I remember at one point asking if the morphology issue would have anything to do with a healthy baby, and my RE being adament about it not having an effect. But clearly something is wrong, since like you I had a bunch arrest between day 3 and day 5, and then two miscarriages.

We did have karotype testing, which is supposedly when the chromosomes aren't adding up/lining up, or something like that.

Reading the blogs, it's definitely interesting the differences any given doctor/center uses, and I do wonder a lot why, or why not things are done a certain way.

Anonymous said...

ok, there is a test for sperms , how about test for eggs,, is there anything to test eggs at all

Egg Donors said...

Great Post.....

I found your site on stumbleupon and read a few of your other posts. Keep up the good work. I just added your RSS feed to my Google News Reader. Looking forward to reading more from you down the road!

Thanks for sharing....

K said...

We haven't done the test, but I just want to mention that we are a classic case of good counts don't necessarily mean much. I wish I would have read about this test a few months ago, but I was apparently too busy trying to figure out what was wrong with my uterus.

And as a fellow science girl, I definitely enjoyed the post and use of "apoptosis".

Nichole said...

Thank you so much for providing such detailed information. We are starting our first cycle of IVF Oct 26th and my hubby has the same or very similar issue as yours. This is so helpful!!!

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